Page 3 of 4
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 06:10 pm
by Carlos
Get gowing Marco, you could coin it in if this ban ever happens
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 06:50 pm
by Marco
Iko wrote:donpacino wrote:If dutch CS close there doors to tourists it will just be a matter of time before the whole tolerance of marijuana will be dropped, the rest of the world would then use this as just another excuse to not legalise/decriminalize it, just imagine it, all the governments around the world would be saying things like:
"if holland, a country known for its tolerance and relaxed attitude towards soft drugs has recognised the dangers associated with marijuana and tolerating marijuana use has again criminalised its use, then we must recognise this and not make the same mistakes they did over 30 years ago"
There would never be another amsterdam, ever, and the whole legalising marijuana movement would take a huge step backwards.
They are already saying it, or atleast that is the byline in every paper around the world that is carrying this news.
Sadly IMO you can trace the blame for this to Bush and the American government going into Iraq and stirring up the readical muslims like a hive of hornets, which has given power to all the fucking nutjob rightwing government crackpots who are feeding off the worlds insecuirity to forward there Christian agendas.
Yeah no one hates Bush more than me, but to connect him to the increasing conservatism of Dutch society is ridiculous!
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 06:57 pm
by Iko
Marco wrote:Iko wrote:donpacino wrote:If dutch CS close there doors to tourists it will just be a matter of time before the whole tolerance of marijuana will be dropped, the rest of the world would then use this as just another excuse to not legalise/decriminalize it, just imagine it, all the governments around the world would be saying things like:
"if holland, a country known for its tolerance and relaxed attitude towards soft drugs has recognised the dangers associated with marijuana and tolerating marijuana use has again criminalised its use, then we must recognise this and not make the same mistakes they did over 30 years ago"
There would never be another amsterdam, ever, and the whole legalising marijuana movement would take a huge step backwards.
They are already saying it, or atleast that is the byline in every paper around the world that is carrying this news.
Sadly IMO you can trace the blame for this to Bush and the American government going into Iraq and stirring up the readical muslims like a hive of hornets, which has given power to all the fucking nutjob rightwing government crackpots who are feeding off the worlds insecuirity to forward there Christian agendas.
Yeah no one hates Bush more than me, but to connect him to the increasing conservatism of Dutch society is ridiculous!
Silly not to see it imo.
You can draw a perfect line conecting the European angst with the Muslims with the invasion of Iraq.
Which in turn has given power to conservative fringe parties in Europe and North America.
If the world was not scared of the boogey man ( muslims ) then these fringe groups would not have gained the foot holds they have.
I wish my grandparents were still alive so i could ask them if they see paralels between now and Europe in the mid to late 1930s.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 07:05 pm
by Marco
Iko wrote:Marco wrote:Iko wrote:
They are already saying it, or atleast that is the byline in every paper around the world that is carrying this news.
Sadly IMO you can trace the blame for this to Bush and the American government going into Iraq and stirring up the readical muslims like a hive of hornets, which has given power to all the fucking nutjob rightwing government crackpots who are feeding off the worlds insecuirity to forward there Christian agendas.
Yeah no one hates Bush more than me, but to connect him to the increasing conservatism of Dutch society is ridiculous!
Silly not to see it imo.
You can draw a perfect line conecting the European angst with the Muslims with the invasion of Iraq.
Which in turn has given power to conservative fringe parties in Europe and North America.
If the world was not scared of the boogey man ( muslims ) then these fringe groups would not have gained the foot holds they have.
I wish my grandparents were still alive so i could ask them if they see paralels between now and Europe in the mid to late 1930s.[/quote
Fine, but you are assuming Dutch culture was is not turning rightward regardless. You are placing too much at the feet of the PVV when the CDA is the one behind this.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 07:18 pm
by Iko
Ya, i am assuming that actually.
Were they really moving towards radical conservatism pre 2001 ?
Either way, the answer is not as simple as i made it sound, and i hope i do not come across like a know it all, because i would never claim to know the intricacies of European politics over Europeans.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 07:22 pm
by Kingdoc
Marco wrote:Iko wrote:Marco wrote:
Yeah no one hates Bush more than me, but to connect him to the increasing conservatism of Dutch society is ridiculous!
Silly not to see it imo.
You can draw a perfect line conecting the European angst with the Muslims with the invasion of Iraq.
Which in turn has given power to conservative fringe parties in Europe and North America.
If the world was not scared of the boogey man ( muslims ) then these fringe groups would not have gained the foot holds they have.
I wish my grandparents were still alive so i could ask them if they see paralels between now and Europe in the mid to late 1930s.[/quote
Fine, but you are assuming Dutch culture was is not turning rightward regardless. You are placing too much at the feet of the PVV when the CDA is the one behind this.
Yea if they can ban overseas people they can ban locals to one day as well,& like you have said marco! the PVV is the junior partner,If this goes threw people should remember it will be the CDA`s fault as they have the final say! i am not gona worry about it,If it happens it happens & they will be welcome to there stag weekends/people chucking up/fighting & pissing in the streets far more than they see now! by the looks of it most will just move on to spain & places like that,What will all the expats do? come home?,Stay? we wont be f***ed as we will just take our fat wallets some place else & our junkie butts not far behind,Its not like were like were all kankers know what i mean! by the looks of it people here are married/have families + hold down decent jobs! & if they dont want us well f**k them frankly,Who would want to go to a place where sections of society are treated totaly like s**t! if they can even push threw half of this stuff,Its hard to see how they are gona be "cosmopolitan" when your gona have stag partys fighting/spewing & pissing in the streets? i dono how they are gona be hip when they have near banned everything & cherry picked whats suited them! tolerance?,If even half of this stuff goes threw it will shatter into smithereens there claims of "tolerance" & even there asperation of being "cosmopolitan" city,I would go as far as saying it will change the fabric of holland for good! & if thats what they all want a holland thats just as bland as everywhere else well good luck to them.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 07:53 pm
by Marco
Iko wrote:Ya, i am assuming that actually.
Were they really moving towards radical conservatism pre 2001 ?
Either way, the answer is not as simple as i made it sound, and i hope i do not come across like a know it all, because i would never claim to know the intricacies of European politics over Europeans.
No worries, I only can relate my opinions too.
I am not sure this government is radially conservative? The lead party is the VVD, which is very fiscally conservative, which relates to the crisis.
But I have no idea what it was like here a decade ago.
I have said before, I think pressure from France and Germany have a lot to do with it. Its an EU issue at some point.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 07:57 pm
by Kingdoc
Marco wrote:Iko wrote:Ya, i am assuming that actually.
Were they really moving towards radical conservatism pre 2001 ?
Either way, the answer is not as simple as i made it sound, and i hope i do not come across like a know it all, because i would never claim to know the intricacies of European politics over Europeans.
No worries, I only can relate my opinions too.
I am not sure this government is radially conservative? The lead party is the VVD, which is very fiscally conservative, which relates to the crisis.
But I have no idea what it was like here a decade ago.
I have said before, I think pressure from France and Germany have a lot to do with it. Its an EU issue at some point.
Would you go home marco if they stopped everything?.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 08:06 pm
by Marco
Kingdoc wrote:Marco wrote:Iko wrote:Ya, i am assuming that actually.
Were they really moving towards radical conservatism pre 2001 ?
Either way, the answer is not as simple as i made it sound, and i hope i do not come across like a know it all, because i would never claim to know the intricacies of European politics over Europeans.
No worries, I only can relate my opinions too.
I am not sure this government is radially conservative? The lead party is the VVD, which is very fiscally conservative, which relates to the crisis.
But I have no idea what it was like here a decade ago.
I have said before, I think pressure from France and Germany have a lot to do with it. Its an EU issue at some point.
Would you go home marco if they stopped everything?.
No way, I came here for a good job. Life, family and the demands of my spouse may move us toward a French-speaking country at some point, but not because of this.
For me, Amsterdam offers great opportunities since my work is valued without speaking the local language fluently.
I think it will be ok in the end anyways. You know to get into Paradiso or Melkweg, one needs a 'membership' so lets see.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 08:09 pm
by Kingdoc
Marco wrote:Kingdoc wrote:Marco wrote:
No worries, I only can relate my opinions too.
I am not sure this government is radially conservative? The lead party is the VVD, which is very fiscally conservative, which relates to the crisis.
But I have no idea what it was like here a decade ago.
I have said before, I think pressure from France and Germany have a lot to do with it. Its an EU issue at some point.
Would you go home marco if they stopped everything?.
No way, I came here for a good job. Life, family and the demands of my spouse may move us toward a French-speaking country at some point, but not because of this.
For me, Amsterdam offers great opportunities since my work is valued without speaking the local language fluently.
I think it will be ok in the end anyways. You know to get into Paradiso or Melkweg, one needs a 'membership' so lets see.
Enjoy it cos guys like you will be rare in the future,Its hard to get a job when you have no1 to serve know what i mean
.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 08:22 pm
by Marco
Kingdoc wrote:Marco wrote:Kingdoc wrote:
Would you go home marco if they stopped everything?.
No way, I came here for a good job. Life, family and the demands of my spouse may move us toward a French-speaking country at some point, but not because of this.
For me, Amsterdam offers great opportunities since my work is valued without speaking the local language fluently.
I think it will be ok in the end anyways. You know to get into Paradiso or Melkweg, one needs a 'membership' so lets see.
Enjoy it cos guys like you will be rare in the future,Its hard to get a job when you have no1 to serve know what i mean
.
Nah, I work in technology, no impact.
But really, its gonna be ok I think!
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 08:26 pm
by Kingdoc
Marco wrote:Kingdoc wrote:Marco wrote:
No way, I came here for a good job. Life, family and the demands of my spouse may move us toward a French-speaking country at some point, but not because of this.
For me, Amsterdam offers great opportunities since my work is valued without speaking the local language fluently.
I think it will be ok in the end anyways. You know to get into Paradiso or Melkweg, one needs a 'membership' so lets see.
Enjoy it cos guys like you will be rare in the future,Its hard to get a job when you have no1 to serve know what i mean
.
Nah, I work in technology, no impact.
But really, its gonna be ok I think!
You sound more worried than any of us
,Was gona book for queensday again next year but i think i will just go to barcelona during august instead! if push comes to shove ive got a plan B there,My mate was there a couple of summers back & his videos & photos are awsome
.
Posted: Sun 10th Oct 2010 08:36 pm
by Dave near London
I dont know - they managed the tobacco ban really well - and at the end of the day , we visitors have been very well accomodated with much hospitality etc . Guide books often mark the abiltity to smoke good quality weed / hash as the top 3 attractions of the Dam (and Holland) - along with all the other good things to see and enjoy. The scene is not at all threatening or dodgy , surely banning visitors will just cause more street dealing etc , and cause problems of a different order.
I can see the issue with border tourist aka Roosendaal etc , - but perpetuation of the status quo as being overall good for the Dutch ecoomy overall - weed etc is often the deciding factor for some people over the other city breaks etc possible , think of the add on to filling seats on Easyjet and Transatlantic flights etc , nver mind the add on issues of hotels , meals , public transport etc etc etc
In dire extremis - my great grandfather was Dutch and never registered officially in the UK - despite living there for 30 years - so I could perhaps plead "grandfather rights" for my rare (and enjoyed visits)
Posted: Mon 11th Oct 2010 01:05 am
by Pauli Wallnuts
Dave near London wrote: nver mind the add on issues of hotels , meals ,
Posted: Mon 11th Oct 2010 01:37 am
by Iko
As stated above a big part of the problem are the whiney baby nanny states that make up the EU and do not like that the weed and hash is "escaping" from Holland into there countries.
Canada knows that pain all too well, we were poised on the brink of legalisation twice when the USA threatened to cut off trade with us if we did.
Of course despite Chreatins best effort he could not convince the states to mind there own god damned business.