Marijuana: Facts and Myths

[Roots Daughter]

Madrid study shows THC coaxes cancerous brain cells to self-digest

Posted April 3, 2009

A new study conducted at Complutense University in Madrid and published in the April edition of US-published Journal of Clinical Investigation shows that THC, the active ingredient in cannabis, helps to defeat brain cancer by coaxing cancerous brain cells to self-digest.

The scientists conducted their research on mice, first stimulating the growth of cancer in the lab animals, then injecting them with a daily dose of THC near the site of their tumors.

The researchers also analyzed the tumors of two patients in an experimental trial looking at the effects of THC on a highly aggressive form of brain tumor, and saw findings “in line with the preclinical evidence” first observed in the laboratory mice.

Source: AFP

http://www.cannabisismedicine.com/news/ ... lf-digest/

[Roots Daughter]

Yes i live in the UK.

No hollistic approach to cures, so people with anxiety aren't recommended to be on some type of SSRI and consoling? People going through cancer don't get Chemo and the offer of consoling? People who are pregnant aren't offered the help of social services as well?

Dr Tashkin published in 2005 the conclusion from a single study that smoking does not cause cancer, however he is very much in the minority of this point of view. In fact in the 5 years since his research has been published it has been contradicted many times, in fact in his conclusions. Tashkin concluded that daily pot smokers experience a 'mild but significant' amount of airflow resistance, this is systematically consistent with bronchial problems, which is strongly associated with people having immune system issues, a good thing when people are ill and possibly have a lower immune system than usual right? Far from saying that inhaling burning plant material is not bad from you. In fact in PubMed 2010, a study showed that vaporizers greatly improved the respiratory health of those administering cannabis for medical reasons. Guess who supported this conculsion, thats right, your man Tashkin.

Cannabis has never been proven to help stop lung etc. cancer. There has been a suggested protective link. The same type of suggested link between Cannabis and Schizophrenia, however i bet you're quick to throw the link between Schizo and Cannabis away, yet so quick to accept the positive image of cannabis?

Brainwashed, it's pretty funny when people who repeat what they read on NORML etc. call other people brainwashed, it's full of the same mistakes and everything!

Perhaps before you publish on a cannabis forum you should actually do your own research into studies etc rather than just taking the summaries of studies by pro-Cannabis groups as being Gospel truth. Also try quoting and supplying studies, also try looking into the background and recent activities of the scientists you quote to justify your point of view, in fact in general use studies not carried out five years ago. Furthermore, don't assert things that simply are not true and are extremely controversial amongst those who research the topics, without actually acknowledgment of the trouble with what you're assuming to be correct. It might help out.

----------------------------------
Jeez, how much proof do some people need? Talk about being brainwashed!

Maybe you shouldn't assume that everything you read on NORML isn't true.
Why don't you check out Granny Storm Crow's list... or will you disavow the credibility of the thousands of links provided there, too?
--------------------------------------

"However, more than 6,500 reports and journal articles from
around the world support the medical value of cannabis (marijuana). In addition, dozens of public health organizations have endorsed medical use of marijuana including the National Association of People Living With AIDS, AIDS Action Council, the American Public Health Association, the American Academy of Family Physicians, the American Nurses Association, the Federation of American Scientists, Kaiser Permanente, the New England Journal of Medicine, the National Association for Public Health Policy, the California Medical Association, the Whitman-Walker Clinic, the Lymphoma Foundation of America, and many more."
http://www.safeaccessnow.org/downloads/ ... search.pdf

http://www.opposingviews.com/i/ama-ends ... l-benefits

"...the International Conference of the American Thoracic Society (ATS) concluding that smoking marijuana, even long-term, is not positively associated with increased incidence of lung-cancer."

http://www.drugscience.org/Archive/bcr1 ... ntano.html

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009 ... renia.html

Doubt cast on cannabis, schizophrenia link


A British study has cast doubt on the supposed link between cannabis use and schizophrenia, but at least one Australian researcher says the study needs more evidence.

Previous research has suggested cannabis use increases the risk of being diagnosed with either psychosis or schizophrenia.

This latest study, led by Dr. Martin Frisher of Keele University, examined the records of 600,000 patients aged between 16 and 44, but failed to find a similar link.

"An important limitation of many studies is that they have failed to distinguish the direction of association between cannabis use and psychosis," the authors write in the September edition of the journal Schizophrenia Research.

They point out that "although using cannabis is associated with a greater risk of developing psychosis, there is also evidence of increased cannabis use following psychosis onset."
Not as predicted

Frisher and colleagues compared the trends of cannabis use with general practitioner records of schizophrenia and psychosis.

They argue that if cannabis use does cause schizophrenia, an increase in cannabis use should be followed by an increase in the incidence of schizophrenia.

According to the study, cannabis use in the United Kingdom between 1972 and 2002 has increased four-fold in the general population, and 18-fold among under-18s.

Based on the literature supporting the link, the authors argue that this should be followed by an increase in schizophrenia incidence of 29 per cent between 1990 and 2010.

But the researchers found no increase in the rates of schizophrenia and psychosis diagnosis during that period. In fact, some of the data suggested the incidence of these conditions had decreased.

"This study does not therefore support the specific causal link between cannabis use and the incidence of psychotic disorders," the authors say. "This concurs with other reports indicating that increases in population cannabis use have not been followed by increases in psychotic incidence."
Study 'just a start'

Prof. Joseph Rey of the Faculty of Medicine at the University of Sydney, whose previous research has identified a link between cannabis and schizophrenia, is skeptical of the study's results.

"Not showing that there is a link does not mean there is no link," he says. "There might be other factors at play that may reduce the incidence of diagnosed schizophrenia."

According to Rey, "this study is just a start and the evidence suggesting that cannabis use does increase the risk of schizophrenia is quite strong. We need more evidence to counteract what we already know."

The authors of the study say that while they cannot completely dismiss all alternative explanations of their data, such explanations "do not appear to be plausible."

[Roots Daughter]

http://lupus.webmd.com/news/20030415/ca ... une-system

Cannabis May Suppress Immune System
Could Lead to New Autoimmune Disorder Treatments, Say Researchers
By Jeanie Lerche Davis
WebMD Health News

April 15, 2003 -- Cannabis may offer hope to people with autoimmune disorders such as lupus and rheumatoid arthritis. Cannabis seems to decrease inflammation in the body by suppressing certain parts of the immune system. Researchers are hoping this finding will lead to new treatments.

Previous studies have hinted at immune system abnormalities among cannabis users -- specifically, in the function of immune system cells called T lymphocytes and natural killer cells. While these cells help the body fight infections, no direct link with lowered immunity has yet been shown.

In this study, researchers tested the blood of 29 cannabis smokers -- 13 occasional users and 16 regular users (weekly or daily use). They compared the results with a group of 32 nonsmokers.

Again, researchers found that cannabis smokers had fewer immune-enhancing natural killer cells and lymphocytes, and higher levels of a protein that may promote tumor growth, called interleukin-10.

These changes can dampen the immune system's response to infection, increasing susceptibility to infections and promoting growth of tumors, states lead researcher Roberta Pacifici, PhD, with the Instituto Superiore di Sanita in Rome, Italy.

But researchers also say this finding could lead to new treatments for people with autoimmune disorders. Current treatments suppress the immune system -- thereby calming the abnormal immune response that plagues people with the conditions.

Cannabis lowers levels of the inflammation-promoting protein interleukin-2 and raises levels of the anti-inflammatory protein interleukin-10. Both of these findings could be of potential benefit for treating autoimmune disorders one day.

SOURCE: The Journal of the American Medical Association, April 16, 2003.

© 2003 WebMD, Inc. All rights reserved.

[Puffin13]

Just a note of caution : Because Cannabis is medically viable does not mean it cures all illness, mental or physical. There's a heap of other things that can help you, don't think you're going to be cured by smoking a bowl. Go see your GP, rather than relying on Rick Simpsons Youtube clips.

You are absolutely right, Sir Niall. Cannabis does not sure all illnesses. BUT it does help with many different types of illnesses and diseases. In some, it DOES cure. What are the "heap of other things that can help you"?

Yes, "don't think you're going to be cured by smoking a bowl" is probably correct. Even Rick Simpson says the same thing. The healing properties of cannabis are not concentrated enough in it's raw form, hence the need for the highly concentrated Hemp Oil.

People should visit their doctor when they are not feeling right. But if the doctor says that you have an illness, the treatment method should be the best available and that doesnt happen with pharma drugs. They are not always the best treatment for some conditions. They also have some very serious side effects; death being one of them. Cannabis is a safe and effective medicine, for some people and for some ailments. It has never killed anyone. But is someone able to get cannabis medicine from their GP? No. In this case, you should treat yourself, if you feel cannabis will work better for you than pills & their many side effects. It should be YOUR choice!

[Sir Niall of Essex-sire]

Why don't you check out Granny Storm Crow's list... or will you disavow the credibility of the thousands of links provided there, too

Yes that's what intelligent people do.

Look, Roots Daughter, you're calling me brainwashed and showing the majority of your supporting evidence from biased ( pro drug ) sources. Oh and quoting Fox News to back you up, that's some strong evidence there

Also, my point about Schizophrenia is that the supposed link is as strong as the supposed protective link between cannabis and cancer. Why do you ignore that link but don't ignore the same link between Cancer and Cannabis? Same applies to the immune system, the link is in need of further study, but you use that as evidence of it being unture but when the same thing is applied to a positive Anti-Cancer aspects it's ignored as just being critical. You have two different standards of evidence, one for the point you agree with, one for the point you don't agree with. That is being disingenuous.

Furthermore, before you call people brainwashed actually understand what brainwashing is; taking information and not questioning it looking at other studies against it. Which is what you have done, you don't question the pro Cannabis stuff you've been told by website with an agenda.

You give the instinct impression of someone who hasn't read any of the studies against your point of view, i used to think like you did, i used to believe that Cannabis was the cure all herb oppressed by the Medical Community because of the influence of big Pharma. However, that's unrealistic bordering on stupid, when you actually talk to people involved in the medical fields the doubts they bring up are valid, uncomfortable but valid.

The most valid being this, life expectancy and quality of life has developed hugely over recent years because of the advancement of medical science, now you come along and say that it's all wrong and all we need to do is use Cannabis and that'll cure all is ridiculous. You stick to Cannabis, i'll stick to stuff that has taken actual scientific research and scrutiny rather than anecdotal evidence.

[Sir Niall of Essex-sire]

Just a note of caution : Because Cannabis is medically viable does not mean it cures all illness, mental or physical. There's a heap of other things that can help you, don't think you're going to be cured by smoking a bowl. Go see your GP, rather than relying on Rick Simpsons Youtube clips.

You are absolutely right, Sir Niall. Cannabis does not sure all illnesses. BUT it does help with many different types of illnesses and diseases. In some, it DOES cure. What are the "heap of other things that can help you"?

Yes, "don't think you're going to be cured by smoking a bowl" is probably correct. Even Rick Simpson says the same thing. The healing properties of cannabis are not concentrated enough in it's raw form, hence the need for the highly concentrated Hemp Oil.

People should visit their doctor when they are not feeling right. But if the doctor says that you have an illness, the treatment method should be the best available and that doesnt happen with pharma drugs. They are not always the best treatment for some conditions. They also have some very serious side effects; death being one of them. Cannabis is a safe and effective medicine, for some people and for some ailments. It has never killed anyone. But is someone able to get cannabis medicine from their GP? No. In this case, you should treat yourself, if you feel cannabis will work better for you than pills & their many side effects. It should be YOUR choice!

To some extend yes, however one has to realize that they do not know what is best for them all the time. If it comes to a point were a medical professional recommends you a treatment and you ignore it in favor of Cannabis which is based on,at this point, extremely shakey scientific evidence which is regularly challenged, results interpretated and twisted by pro cannabis organisations and anecdotal evidence. Well, that's something IMO no-one without a want to justify their drug use wouldn't do.

Cannabis does have some medical value, however is it Cancer preventing? Only as much as it's Schizophrenia inducing according to recent studies. In fact, there have been many more studies showing a link to mental illness that Cannabis being a preventive measure against cancer.

To name drop here, i hope he doesn't mind i'll delete if he wants, our forum legend DC recently experienced chest problems which means he can't smoke Cannabis. If what RootsDaughter is saying is true, then why doesn't DC just smoke weed, weeds not harmful after all, his doctors are lying, he's lying. Right? No, he's not lying, this is anecdotal evidence the type of anecdotal evidence used by pro-Medical when it's in favor of their point of view but ignore when it's against their point of view.

[Puffin13]

To name drop here, i hope he doesn't mind i'll delete if he wants, our forum legend DC recently experienced chest problems which means he can't smoke Cannabis. If what RootsDaughter is saying is true, then why doesn't DC just smoke weed, weeds not harmful after all, his doctors are lying, he's lying. Right? No, he's not lying, this is anecdotal evidence the type of anecdotal evidence used by pro-Medical when it's in favor of their point of view but ignore when it's against their point of view.

At the risk of repeating myself:

Yes, "don't think you're going to be cured by smoking a bowl" is probably correct. Even Rick Simpson says the same thing. The healing properties of cannabis are not concentrated enough in it's raw form, hence the need for the highly concentrated Hemp Oil.

[Roots Daughter]

If what RootsDaughter is saying is true, then why doesn't DC just smoke weed, weeds not harmful after all, his doctors are lying, he's lying. Right? No, he's not lying, this is anecdotal evidence the type of anecdotal evidence used by pro-Medical when it's in favor of their point of view but ignore when it's against their point of view.

Umm, when did I ever say that "weeds not harmful, after all"??

Your words not mine.

Cannabis is no more a cure-all than aspirin.

Cannabis is far less harmful than aspirin, but has many more useful properties.

You say many things that aren't true, with nothing to back your opinions up.

I have provided links to scientific studies, reports, journals, etc.
You have provided opinions and insults.

If you don't like my links, why not check out Granny Storm Crows List?

Or, will you dismiss every single one of the links there, too? (probably without reading any)

Why don't you try reading and listening more, and arguing less?

You'll learn more.

--Roots Daughter

[Roots Daughter]

BTW, it doesn't really help your credibility when you dismiss every single link provided to you without providing any yourself.

Using such tired phrases as "according to recent studies" and "there have been many more studies" without actually quoting any... proves nothing.

You dismiss every single link I have pointed to, although you have misquoted a few of the studies I have quoted.

I am at somewhat of a disadvantage, as anything positive about cannabis is usually ignored by media, while every negative lie is plastered across the front page.

That is why we must rely on forums like this to find out about these studies.
Then we do the research.

If you are having trouble searching or telling a credible source from a non-credible one, let me help you, I have been a cataloguing librarian for over 25 years, so I have a little experience searching databases and analyzing data.

My sources:
The Journal of The American Medical Association, UCLA, Dr. Donald Tashkin (if you look back at quotes I highlighted from his study, you will see that they refute what you claimed he had said), National Association of People Living With AIDS, AIDS Action Council, the American Public Health Association, the American Academy of Family Physicians, the American Nurses Association, the Federation of American Scientists, Kaiser Permanente, University of Otago, Dunedin, New Zealand, the Journal of Clinical Investigation, U.S., The New England Journal of Medicine, the National Association for Public Health Policy, the California Medical Association, the Whitman-Walker Clinic, the Lymphoma Foundation of America, Schizophrenia Research Journal, etc...



and your sources are... ?

--Roots Daughter

[Sir Niall of Essex-sire]

Umm, when did I ever say that "weeds not harmful, after all"??

It's called paraphrasing, what you're doing is called not adressing the point but concentrating on semantics? Answer the question, or does it go against your point of view so you cannot answer it? Showing yourself yet again to be a disingenuous blind supporter of the course?

Your words not mine.

Cannabis is no more a cure-all than aspirin.

Cannabis is far less harmful than aspirin, but has many more useful properties.

Sources? ( If you demand them of me then surely it's fair to demand them of you?)

You say many things that aren't true, with nothing to back your opinions up.

Like?

I have provided links to scientific studies, reports, journals, etc.
You have provided opinions and insults.

Not at all, you have provided some, just like i told you to check MedPub journal, what you've done is provided lots of links to websites which provide a summary of the studies. This is called SECONDARY REFERENCING, and it's worth...fuck all. Reference the primary sources for any type of credibility.

If you don't like my links, why not check out Granny Storm Crows List?

Or, will you dismiss every single one of the links there, too? (probably without reading any)

Again, yes i will question all studies, because it's what an intelligent person does, not accepting what seems to support their viewpoint without questioning it.

Why don't you try reading and listening more, and arguing less?

Because you don't have a truth beyond mine, you have mostly provided links to studies quoted on pro Cannabis sites, any guess what their bias will be? So why am i going to accept the interpretations of studies by pro-Cannabis sites, or you who shows an incredible skill in not questioning this bias?

You'll learn more.
And i'm the insulting one?
--Roots Daughter

[Sir Niall of Essex-sire]

BTW, it doesn't really help your credibility when you dismiss every single link provided to you without providing any yourself.

Using such tired phrases as "according to recent studies" and "there have been many more studies" without actually quoting any... proves nothing.

You dismiss every single link I have pointed to, although you have misquoted a few of the studies I have quoted.

I am at somewhat of a disadvantage, as anything positive about cannabis is usually ignored by media, while every negative lie is plastered across the front page.

That is why we must rely on forums like this to find out about these studies.
Then we do the research.

If you are having trouble searching or telling a credible source from a non-credible one, let me help you, I have been a cataloguing librarian for over 25 years, so I have a little experience searching databases and analyzing data.

My sources:
The Journal of The American Medical Association, UCLA, Dr. Donald Tashkin (if you look back at quotes I highlighted from his study, you will see that they refute what you claimed he had said), National Association of People Living With AIDS, AIDS Action Council, the American Public Health Association, the American Academy of Family Physicians, the American Nurses Association, the Federation of American Scientists, Kaiser Permanente, University of Otago, Dunedin, New Zealand, the Journal of Clinical Investigation, U.S., The New England Journal of Medicine, the National Association for Public Health Policy, the California Medical Association, the Whitman-Walker Clinic, the Lymphoma Foundation of America, Schizophrenia Research Journal, etc...



and your sources are... ?

--Roots Daughter

No you haven't referenced those journals in their primary source. Webmed is the most credible site you've provided. Which is a bit shit.

Oh and don't forget Fox News, that's fucking credible for sure.

Are you a member of any of the journal online databases, i can't link if you don't have an account. I will be copy the entire entries if not, but it will take up room, if you tell me what academic database you're on i can say time and space on this thread.

[Roots Daughter]

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Still waiting for you to back up your ignorant, uninformed opinions... and waiting... and waiting...

--Roots Daughter

[DC]

"There are none so blind as those who refuse to see."
From where I'm sitting I can see good counter argument, so I think yer quote is self applicable Roots.

[Sir Niall of Essex-sire]

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Still waiting for you to back up your ignorant, uninformed opinions... and waiting... and waiting...

--Roots Daughter

And again Roots Daughter, you seem to be one of these annoying people who doesn't answer questions, which online journal bank are you a member of so i cant post links you can log in to?

And while you're answering questions you ignore, why are you using secondary references, do you think thats viable? What about DC, doesn't his case alone show you that there is at least doubt on the preventive nature of Cannabis for bronchial problems? Why do you have two different standards of evidence, one for your argument, one against?

EDIT : There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Seriously, this type of half baked Philosophical ideas annoys me greatly, it's couch Philosophers that ruin the art of Philosophy with stupid fucking statements.

Perhaps you refuse to see the other point of view to your own, but i'm sure toking a bowl gives you some magical insight into the world that i cannot phaeton. So i'll leave you the words of B.Russel, a man who was actually a man of Philosophy rather than spurting out half baked ideas.

"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt."
-Bertrand Russell

As in those who cast doubt over the magic of Cannabis.

[Roots Daughter]

I subscribe to no journals, some of your questions make no sense, I never said cannabis was perfect or a cure-all or anything like that... why do you insist that it does no good?

I don't insist it does no harm, which you seem to be implying...

I back up what I say... you rant and make no sense.

Disregard all my sources if you want... if you read them you would see what researchers and Universities Fox News and others are quoting... I'm not posting long articles here. I read studies that say good things and bad things about cannabis, and then I do more research because as I said before, you can't rely on the media for anything except the negative.

You make many insults, accusations and assumptions, but you don't have anything to back up what you say except more insults and more half-baked (if you'll pardon the pun) opinions.

You asked how cannabis is less harmful than Aspirin? My apologies... I assumed that anyone who subscribes to this list would know that Aspirin has a low toxicity level, while the toxicity level of cannabis is theoretically many times a person's body weight. I say theoretically because, unlike Aspirin, no one has ever overdosed from Cannabis. Forgive me for assuming that you knew this.

If you intend to continue ranting and flaming, then this will be my last post to you. If you want to start having an intelligent conversation, it would be my pleasure.
--Roots Daughter