Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

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Pierre von Mondragon
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Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Pierre von Mondragon »

I'm voting YES for a number of reasons, foremost amongst them accountability. The UK has one of the most corruptible, change-resistant polities in the West, First Past The Post PLUS an unelected Upper Chamber, and in that system the opinion of Scotland carries little weight. As the UK drifts ever rightwards, Labour triangulates its policies via the Tories and now UKIP, so that at best the natural party of the workers offer an neo-liberalised vaguely social democracy. Enough, Scotland is enough of a distinct culture, not to mention an ancient kingdom dating to 843, that such a lack of accountability is a wrong that must be remedied. Also there is one last oil boom in the pipeline, off Shetland, why should it be squandered on Trident and HS2, we have had enough of subsidising the UK, while being flagrantly lied to, and denigrated as the ones who are being subsidised. We've paid for out prescriptions and education through out hydrocarbon wealth, reflected in the Barnett formula.

There is a strong chance that I would not have voted to leave the Britain I was born into in the 70s, but I have no hesitancy about leaving the country it has become, it is incapable of changing path now, YES on September 18th!

http://www.yesscotland.net/

fully sourced facts, albeit from a partisan source
http://wingsoverscotland.com/


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darkglobe
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by darkglobe »

So Scottish Pollyticians are uncorruptible and never tell flagrant lies,eh?It must the only ccountry where thats the case then :)
and i'm with you on the Yes vote,if only to stick it up Cameron's and all his slimy pals arse'oles :mrgreen:
"That cats something i can't explain"
Ganjaman70
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Ganjaman70 »

I'm voting yes purely because I don't like nor trust those shower of scummy kiddy fiddling cunts at Westminster, and because Scotland deserves to have scots make our decisions not those English fuckers down South!
It WAS a birthday trip to remember.. 25/7-31/7
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Padge247
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Padge247 »

I am not trying to suggest that the UK government isn't at all corrupt, but it is not even close to being the most corrupt in Europe (think Italy, Spain, France, I assume (possibly wrongly so) a few of the old Soviet states have also had their fair share of corruption).

I am from England (consider myself British) and I would vote no if I had a say. Currency issues, EU membership issues, logistical/infrastructural issues, amount of Debt Scotland would have to take on, are all reasons I think Scotland would be weakened. The rest of the UK would loose it's position in the oil sector, impact on GDP/business in general, less clout in Europe.

The UK political system is in need of reform, it is outdated and has many flaws, and similarly I understand and agree with the argument of greater devolution of powers to the Scottish Parliament, I just feel evolution, rather than revolution, is the way forward.

Unsurprisingly all the Scottish people I know in and around Amsterdam are against independence
Ganjaman70
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Ganjaman70 »

I like a good debate especially with a person who understands what they are debating about but in all honesty I've never read so much pish where Scotland will be a weaker country without the rest of the UK... Please explain why when we have as a nation.....
Oil & Gas worth £1,500 billion
Europes wave energy 10%
Europes wind and tidal potential 25%
Whiskey export £4.3 billion
Construction £17 billion
Tourism £10 billion
Rural and Island £32 billion
Creative industries £5 billion
Manufacturing exports £15 billion
Life sciences £1.9 billion
Food and drink £13 billion

We also pay more tax per head than anywhere else in the UK, so don't harp on about how Scotland will be weakened, if we don't keep the currency we won't have a national debt so as William Wallace once said FREEDOM!
It WAS a birthday trip to remember.. 25/7-31/7
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treetop
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by treetop »

Ditch England if you don't like fracking.
How much did you produce?
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Pierre von Mondragon
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Pierre von Mondragon »

Padge247 wrote: The rest of the UK would loose it's position in the oil sector, impact on GDP/business in general, less clout in Europe.
I think this is the key fact uppermost in Westminster's mind, but when a fifth of all Scots kids are born into poverty, why should the fate of rUK bother me? The UK is ineptly governed, and has squandered the hydrocarbon bonanza by not setting up an oil fund, therefore we should swiftly move to make sure what is left of it is spent on upgrading Scottish infrastructure, and preparing for a post-carbon economy (eventually).

England only has 10% of North Sea oil, and when an Independent Scotland challenges the ludicrous sea border imposed by Blair, where sea directly east of Fife not classed as Scottish, it will have even less, never mind, there is always fracking, but we don't need that up here, ta.

Finally, apropos of nothing, seeing the Welsh 1st Minister claiming that the Barnett formula must go, post a naw vote was hysterical, as we put in far far more than the Principality; Cardigan oil? Cardiff Whisky??? We'll support you when you decide it's your turn, and I understand that the FM is just another Labour goon, so all is forgiven...
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Lemming
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Lemming »

As an Englishman (with, incidentally, a Scottish partner) my concern is that if Scotland were to leave they would take a substantial block of safe Labour seats with them. That could lead to more right-wing governments for the remainder of the UK in the future.

Fortunately I think it's unlikely to happen. I think Alex Salmond has lost his innocence. After running Scotland for while he now looks like just another politician rather than a heroic campaigner.
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spidergawd
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by spidergawd »

Ganjaman70 wrote: if we don't keep the currency we won't have a national debt so as William Wallace once said FREEDOM!
As part of the UK and presumably, or though you might differ on this, Scotland was a beneficiary of some of that debt, then it will have to take on it's share of paying it back. Something that will be negotiated and argued about for years no doubt, while us taxpayers north and south of the border will spend millions and millions paying the lawyers and accountants who will do the arguing. Likewise loads of issues, it wont be cheap and a few years down the road when fuck alls changed you'll wonder why you bothered.
I really dont think you walk away clean with an "I'm off!" :shock: :mrgreen:

After tonights debate I'm thinking they'll go for it Lemming.
What a long strange trip it is.
Kermit
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Kermit »

Hard decision, and I doubt very much you will get out without a massive debt and very much doubt you will get much oil, be Good to see how it unfolds tbh,
Ganjaman70 wrote:I like a good debate especially with a person who understands what they are debating about but in all honesty I've never read so much pish where Scotland will be a weaker country without the rest of the UK... Please explain why when we have as a nation.....
Oil & Gas worth 1,500 billion
wave energy 10%
wind and tidal potential 25%
Whiskey export 4.3 billion
Construction 17 billion
Tourism 10 billion
Rural and Island 32 billion
Creative industries 5 billion
Manufacturing exports 15 billion
Life sciences 1.9 billion
Food and drink 13 billion

We also pay more tax per head than anywhere else in the UK, so don't harp on about how Scotland will be weakened, if we don't keep the currency we won't have a national debt so as William Wallace once said FREEDOM!

Made a few adjustments as you can see, no u.k no currency and no Europe, so how much is that trade worth? It's a hard decision, Good luck to you guys
Alo
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Alo »

The whole thing will open a can of worms.
If the uk can give Hong Kong back along with the other common wealth country's.
Scotland can go back too.
I just see northern Ireland and all the ira bombings to be a bit pointless now. Lol
Ganjaman70
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Ganjaman70 »

Well according to last nights debate on tv between darling and salmond the UK can't stop us or anyone using the £... As salmond said if they refuse to honour the scots from using it then we just walk away and won't have a debt... As mr cuntwipe darling said that would affect world trade and lending money to Scotland etc but the argument is it's the uk debt not Scotland..... A debt that was run up by labour and the Tories, it's in their interest that we accept a proportion and agree to pay back each year and if they refuse then Scotland has tried...

As for the bombings in northern island by the IRA being pointless..... Seriously who cares about them, I say fill the coast with barb wire and bomb the fucking lot of them and be done with the troubles once as for all, an for the record the IRA never once bombed main land Scotland, anyway this threads about te Scottish referendum not some scally inbred Irish twats!
It WAS a birthday trip to remember.. 25/7-31/7
Alo
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Alo »

Your all ginger n celtic away with the lot of ya.
Fuck the lot of ya. Put up Haydrians wall again.
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treetop
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by treetop »

Alo wrote:Your all ginger n celtic away with the lot of ya.
Fuck the lot of ya. Put up Haydrians wall again.
If that happens it will be to the keep the English out.
How much did you produce?
Alo
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Re: Scottish Independence Referendum 18/09/14

Post by Alo »

I'm sure they can do without kilts haggis and bag pipes mate :mrgreen:

Barring north sea oil scotts got nothing.
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