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Trad wrote:

The French are the worst for that, sometimes they won't even help you because you're not fluent enough in French or because they do not want to speak English even if they do. But they're just.... French.

I have found that the French-Canadians in Quebec do the same thing, even though you're trying to speak the language....arrogance??

Nah, the Dutch are much worse. They simply refuse to speak their language, unless you are really competent.

Not that many French people speak English very well.

Marco wrote:

Trad wrote:

The French are the worst for that, sometimes they won't even help you because you're not fluent enough in French or because they do not want to speak English even if they do. But they're just.... French.

I have found that the French-Canadians in Quebec do the same thing, even though you're trying to speak the language....arrogance??

Nah, the Dutch are much worse. They simply refuse to speak their language, unless you are really competent.

Not that many French people speak English very well.

This is everywhere in the world, people want to one up english speakers by showing that they are more competent in your language then you are in theirs. It is annoying that we have to accept that too often as the truth, so the only way to respond is by being confident about being an english speaker. don't shy away from continuing to speak someones language even if they switch to english.. the reason they are able to is from practice, so you have to be assertive about your desire to improve your language skills, and don't let them talk you out of it either. doing so will defy their expectations of english speakers (esp. american) and win you some respect.


just speak with a dutch accent when you speak english, that's close enough. throwing in some dutch phrases here and there such as "nee" (no) "ja" (yes) "dank u, alstublieft' (thank you. please) and "je zit er lekker uit" (for the ladies) shows good will and will take you places. it's not worth learning dutch for a short trip

"alstublieft',I always wondered why they kept saying please! double dutch indeed .

It all depends on who you converse with. Some will happily except you trying a little nederlands on them, others will just blankly refuse. Pot luck I'm afraid. I find that most complement me on my nederlands language skills, but then I come from a dutch family (my father) and I have taught myself over many years, so I have the basics.

Most of the centrum will just give you a blank look as they dont have a fucking clue how to speak it either.

Speaking to native English speakers who live over there and have learned Dutch, they're view is that getting past the pronounciation is the hardest and learning the language is not so bad as is it is more closley related to English than German for example.

Boner wrote:Most of the centrum will just give you a blank look as they dont have a fucking clue how to speak it either.

Very much so!

Where I live it's okay until they suss that you're not Dutch (they seem to have some sort of telepathic ability to do this) and then they just
start practicing their English on me

Am getting there slowly though, have had lessons, I could have cried after some of them, felt like a total failure, other times you get one
little thing right and you feel on top of the world.

I managed a full sentence the other week and the wife was most impressed !

The video i used to learn me the one to 10.






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnjZFDzv1CE

youngian wrote:Speaking to native English speakers who live over there and have learned Dutch, they're view is that getting past the pronounciation is the hardest and learning the language is not so bad as is it is more closley related to English than German for example.

That's the approach I'm taking- focusing on pronunciation first, while building basic vocabulary/phrases. Grammar and werkwoord vervoeging (verb conjugation) can come latter. A few language learning programs/apps have the ability to slow down the speed of the native speaker, while still maintaining pitch- this really helps you get the nuance of the pronunciation. BYKI (Before You Know It) sports this, and has both computer and iPhone s/w. Google Translator will speak whatever you want translated, but can't do the slow down thing, unfortunately. I find the r's pronounced in the back of the throat challenging, as in the word, draai.

Also, note to self, remember the difference between room (cream) and raam (window) when asking for some of it with my koffie.