bin laiden is brown bread

[Cisco]

Yawn ! What difference does it make dead or alive ? NONE ! Terrorism will continue as before

[redeyezman]

the flag is up the pole and flying....good shot fellas

The Gadsden flag I hope!

[Uncle Ron]

[quote="artymac"][/quote]

Nice read.
I take it from what you wrote that you have no love-loss for Pakistan? Neither do I, and by that I mean the government and not necessarily the people.
As for the US, I don't care much for the govt., mostly because elected officials are puppets of a warped (read broken) capitalist system. Don't misunderstand, I love capitalism, and socialism equally as well. Both can coexist peacefully, but not with those who currently hold the power. Read the edition of the Forbes magazine that lists the Top 500 Companies and the Top 100 Wealthiest People. Here one will find most of those who are responsible for the shit we are in today, not to mention historically. The ends almost never justify the means, no matter how some try to state otherwise. History is full of examples and lessons learned that are ignored. That's why people keep making the same stupid and ignorant mistakes.

Ever wonder why the powerful and elite want the masses to be ignorant? Easier to manipulate, like sheep.
The Sheeple Principle:
Sheppard = capitalists/religious leaders/etc...
Sheep dog = politicians/law enforcement/mass media/etc...
Sheep = people

Nothing happy about this...

[echc1]

ok,so the boogie man is dead...so what!?....will it stop terrorism? NO!!!...will the terror laws be repealed? no! we'll still have all the stupid searches and the "war on terror" and still the biggest terrorists are still walking amongst us....the bankers and politicians and oil companies...will the world go back to normal? no chance!....as a witness to the harrods bomb(IRA),being in the states during 9/11 and being in one of the 1st few vehicles to be allowed through lockerbie ,i guess as long as someone is pissed off at someone else there will always be terrorism!!! get over it! and move on....and bring the troops home instead of wasting fine guys out in afghanistan

[geoffk]

A little editoral from one of the most trusted news sources on this Bin Laden matter.

[travelling high]

Nice read.
I take it from what you wrote that you have no love-loss for Pakistan? Neither do I, and by that I mean the government and not necessarily the people.
As for the US, I don't care much for the govt., mostly because elected officials are puppets of a warped (read broken) capitalist system. Don't misunderstand, I love capitalism, and socialism equally as well. Both can coexist peacefully, but not with those who currently hold the power. Read the edition of the Forbes magazine that lists the Top 500 Companies and the Top 100 Wealthiest People. Here one will find most of those who are responsible for the shit we are in today, not to mention historically. The ends almost never justify the means, no matter how some try to state otherwise. History is full of examples and lessons learned that are ignored. That's why people keep making the same stupid and ignorant mistakes.

Ever wonder why the powerful and elite want the masses to be ignorant? Easier to manipulate, like sheep.
The Sheeple Principle:
Sheppard = capitalists/religious leaders/etc...
Sheep dog = politicians/law enforcement/mass media/etc...
Sheep = people

Nothing happy about this...

' A debate that will never have true answers.. Maybe for all those that dont like the way a government is ran should buy an island and show us all how to run things proper.. Back door things are done in every nation whether it's people agree with it or not. With Bin Laden's death some say it will bring even more fighting but if they indeed have the power to do so than after 9/11 why not continue your crusade ;why hide? A true martyr doesnt hide if he truly values his cause he would and should be at the forefront. Saddam was in a dirt hole and Bin Laden was hiding right in front of the Pakistani govt. And as if the later didnt know considering his proximity to a military installation. So does one mans killing justify the end? Not at all.. But it does cripple a radical sect of a religion that indeed does not share his beliefs. And I hate to say it Uncle Ron but these wars of attrition have being raging for centuries before Forbes and capitalism existed for that matter.

[travelling high]

the flag is up the pole and flying....good shot fellas

The Gadsden flag I hope!

Good call

[steven]

I hear Elton John will release a song in his memory.....
Sandals in the bin

[geoffk]

There's already a new cocktail, the Osama: two shots in water. Badaboom

[travelling high]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI_CdlJbYGw

[Midzy]

This post is for people who dont beleve the Bin man is dead..............Well lets imagine the yanks are lying... OK so why? and don't yer think that he would pop up in a video holding todays newspaper or summat and saying "fuck you America I am alive you lying sods"

[Uncle Ron]

"...Maybe for all those that dont like the way a government is ran should buy an island and show us all how to run things proper.."

Using your logic, if those who didn't like the way their govt. was being ran went and bought their own island, I think there would be a need for a couple of billion islands. Something to think about...
I don't know your nationality, but in the US, a citizen has a right and in part, is expected to speak out if they disagree. We have something in our Constitution that guarantees us this freedom, it's called the First Amendment. May I suggest you read The Constitution of the United States, it's an incredible read, I promise.

And I hate to say it Uncle Ron but these wars of attrition have being raging for centuries before Forbes and capitalism existed for that matter.

Somewhat true; Forbes yes, capitalism no. In various forms, capitalism has existed for thousands of years. Think about it some more, you will see it...
I used Forbes as an example of how the world has changed, specifically post Industrial Revolution. This is when capitalism really took off, and the real global damage began. All one has to do is a little research into multi-national corporations, specifically their expansionism. Draw your own conclusions, I have and mine are right.
So, what to do about these problems? We could do nothing, as some would want. We could do things half-assed, like the Gulf of Mexico fiasco, also as some would want. Or people could unite and make a real difference.

The power lies with the people, always has. But until the people truly unite, putting aside what I consider petty differences, a small number of people will continue to manipulate the world as they see fit.

Some of my thinking may appear to be naive, but appearances can and usually are deceiving, although I am not a deceptive person by nature.
Take what you will from my rantings, but I challenge anyone to find fault with the fundamental principles of which I speak, and that is Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.

And then there is the ever present... to each their own

Happy terror-free societies...

[travelling high]

"...Maybe for all those that dont like the way a government is ran should buy an island and show us all how to run things proper.."

Using your logic, if those who didn't like the way their govt. was being ran went and bought their own island, I think there would be a need for a couple of billion islands. Something to think about...
I don't know your nationality, but in the US, a citizen has a right and in part, is expected to speak out if they disagree. We have something in our Constitution that guarantees us this freedom, it's called the First Amendment. May I suggest you read The Constitution of the United States, it's an incredible read, I promise.

And I hate to say it Uncle Ron but these wars of attrition have being raging for centuries before Forbes and capitalism existed for that matter.

Somewhat true; Forbes yes, capitalism no. In various forms, capitalism has existed for thousands of years. Think about it some more, you will see it...
I used Forbes as an example of how the world has changed, specifically post Industrial Revolution. This is when capitalism really took off, and the real global damage began. All one has to do is a little research into multi-national corporations, specifically their expansionism. Draw your own conclusions, I have and mine are right.
So, what to do about these problems? We could do nothing, as some would want. We could do things half-assed, like the Gulf of Mexico fiasco, also as some would want. Or people could unite and make a real difference.

The power lies with the people, always has. But until the people truly unite, putting aside what I consider petty differences, a small number of people will continue to manipulate the world as they see fit.

Some of my thinking may appear to be naive, but appearances can and usually are deceiving, although I am not a deceptive person by nature.
Take what you will from my rantings, but I challenge anyone to find fault with the fundamental principles of which I speak, and that is Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.

And then there is the ever present... to each their own

Happy terror-free societies...

Bin Laden is dead.. Roll on Capitalism .. FYI Ron I love free speech.. Thats why I used it

[Uncle Ron]

Bin Laden is dead.. Roll on Capitalism .. FYI Ron I love free speech.. Thats why I used it

I received your PM, thank you.
I retract the part about the Constitution, although I recommend to all that they read this document. It's not perfect (Article 1, Section 2, Clause 3; EVERYONE IS CREATED EQUAL, NO SUCH THING AS 3/5THS OF A PERSON)! http://press-pubs.uchicago.edu/founders ... 1_2_3.html
...and a few other areas as well. I do agree with most amendments, although I think the Constitution covers just about everything. Some things had to be spelled out, you know, ignorance and all that (ex...those who had manipulated the system, and unfortunately still do today).

I agree, OBL is dead.
As for Capitalism rolling on, at least in it's current state, this is where we differ, extremely. As long as we remain civil, constructive and productive dialogue can be had. Just saying...

Peace to all...

[artymac]

"Uncle Ron", I have a lot of sympathy with many of people in the "Pakistani" government and a hugh amount of sympathy for the vast, vast majority of the people in the country, who are powerless in the face of the endemic corruption at every turn and at level, of their society.
Pop in poverty and everything that goes with it on a grand scale, terrorism, and living in a region where disaster never seems far away.
The people in government who are trying to make a difference, in the direction of the western way of thinking in regard to terrorism, are constantly hindered and undermined by this corruption and by the people who would want to push opinion and actions in the anti-western direction, who are only to willing to utilise this corruption.
Bribes/pay-off are a way of life. It greases the wheels, or nothin' much moves.

Couple that with life is cheap, and very expendable, with little chance of being held accountable and again every chance that a surprisingly small amount of money will do the trick. "That'll do nicely, sir."
'Bloody money', is openly, publicly and more crudely seen to be done, ..than in the refined courtroom squeezes, secret deals and moral aloofness that befits the sensibilities of other players a world away. The deal's the same, hit the translate button, but it's the levels of this corruption that will need a hugh effort to show any results.

The government has to fight their own war on terror, as well as the international war on terror.
Both 'terrors' cloak themselves in religion, so any attack on them, or their 'brothers', is an attack on their religion, which is the countries religion, so an attack on the countries people themselves. Catch22. "Rumsfeld" couldn't have put it any better, eh "spidergawd"
In particular, where anti-western views are held, this is taught and is the daily spoken word amongst a population that are poor, needy, hear only one side of the story and are no different in joining in when someone tells them it's all other peoples fault, who are foreign, non-muslim and they will lead the people against this injustice and their own government that allows it to happen.
Give them hope and hang anyone who says anything else as a traitor and an example.
Look at the disgraceful situation when the government was ready to give the "Taliban" control of part of the country, in return for peace.... then the innocents started to pile up in town squares..... dancers, singers, anyone a little jumped up fuckwit with a perverse take on a religion and a "Kalashnikov", who wanted to settle a score, that 99.99% of the people who practice that religion would say, this is not the religion i know or follow.
Power/influence and money/possessions. The Never Ending Story.
This is also complicated by ethnic groups, divisions in religion, tribal groups, warlords, druglords, bonglord(only kidding ) the "Pakistani" government have got it tough, some could argue, that a lot of it is their own making for failing to act decisively when needed.
But it's a tightrope they're walking, whilst the west keeps giving them a hefty shove now and again for action.
Who do you get to replace your present representatives if they fall? Will the west have any more confidence in who follows? That, what can be bought, can be sold. So money might not be as valuable as thought and can often turn up for use in places you'd not expect.
Giving lots of money for some groups, headmen's, warlord's promises and assurances, does not work. Or only does as long as a better offer doesn't comes along, or they are usurped and new talks begin again.
From reading what yourself and "Travelling high" have posted, you both still seem to be singing from the same hyme sheet. Politics is corrupt and simply a means to an end for many people/governments.
If this is true (which i believe it is) to a greater or lesser extent of all countries, where does it leave countries like "Pakistan", with vote rigging, with the headmen in remote areas of the country deciding how the people they have influence over vote and wholesale intimidation in parts. It a fragile democracy at best, but theoretically everyone has a say in the countries future. Something i'd like to see built upon in "Pakistan", the surrounding region and indeed the WORLD in general.

As for the should we, shouldn't we, show a confirming image to prove OBL is dead.
No, if it shows an image that will be useful to the extremists and would become iconic in furthering their cause.
Yes, if it suitably shows OBL, caught in the moment of contact with the marines before what went down, went down. That way no doubt for all, but the diehard conspiracy theoryists.
Slight problem. OBL's daughter claimed he was 'capture' in the first few minutes of the assault. Could a child under the extreme pressure of a situation like that, make up a conflicting story of events to further complicate things and give extremists an angle to exploit?
Those marines know what happened, as does many people in the "Whitehouse". They may not be out of the woods yet.

"geoffk" yer wicked, yer wicked. There's is nothin' like bein' even handed and that was nothin' like even handed.
What a bunch of wankers, but dangerous wankers i'll bet.
It's amazing how often the targets of their hate are mirrored by the extremists on the opposite side. Lots of common ground.
Lightheartedly, i thought i'd see what the weather was like on their site.
They'd just love the wee guy who does the weather for my local TV station. Each time i see him i keep expecting him to start dancin' and burst into song; "It's rainin' men, ..Hallelujah"!!!

Got to go and put my money where my mouth is now.... I'm away to vote and then i'm goin' to have a joint.!! (Topboot )
Remember, if you are lucky enough to have a vote use it. If you don't vote....don't bitch.