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Sir Niall of Essex-sire wrote:

Ludicrous statement? So they never carried out atrocities in the name of ridding religion from their society? History lessons might help man.

You call my statement ludicrous, think about what you've just said. You dont have a problem with people doing things wrong unless its in the susposed name of God that you have a problem? So that Ian Huntlys an alright chap, so's Hitler i dont know what the fuss was about him, at least he wasnt religious. Dude epic fail.

Again are you actually going to answer any questions criticising your man Dawkins?

TRANCE wrote: I knew Hitler was going to be brought up soon, as always with debates like these, whatever. Hitler was not an atheist or became one, he was raised Catholic. Further still, when he was young he was in awe of the Church and even considered joining the priesthood, much against his fathers wishes. If memory serves me right, this was stated in the first couple of chapters in Mein Kampf, when I read it. So therefore, he did indeed have a religious and influential start to life, regardless. To quote Hitler in later years .. I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Creator. By fighting off the Jews. I am doing the Lord's work.

Indeed you are right, but was he a practicising Catholic? To imply belief in God in speech is all too easy, when you stub your toe and say Oh My God, to practice that belief. The action which actually defines and asserts membership of a church, sect, cult etc. Is much harder to come by. However i take your point.

What about Polput and Stalin? Remarkably quite on those two eh?

And bingo, I think this member has finally got it!

Full house

Yes, there is nothing worse when evil is so fully and joyfully committed under religious conviction, more so than not, but that does not lead me to having no problems with people committing evil if they are not religious, for goodness sake. Some individuals in history are just simple despotic tyrants, regardless if they are religious or not, but it's worse when it's fanatical religious tyrants doing bad under the name of God/Allah, etc.

I judge evil on actions rather than motivation, same as good actions, if someone does good i am happy with that, rather than questioning why they done it.

Dear me, I really don't have time for all this relentlessness. It's all getting a little overly obsessive from this member and progressively insignificant. How so Without being impolite, I've got far more things going on in my life than to sit here and discuss, even justify my personal views with a complete stranger over the internet. So much better to have views expressed with no justification i guess. I currently have far too much work on at the moment to dedicate time to this, being self employed, with more spare time at weekends for involvement in the few forums I frequent, not all related to Amsterdam, I hasten to add. However, lets not completely hijack the whole thread and stop other members opening up discussions on their own topics. I feel this has had it's fair share of debate, albeit as shallow as I wanted it to be in a light hearted public forum relating to Amsterdam and marijuana This sections off topic, hence the off topic discussion. I honestly feel you're edging towards getting unnecessarily personal, with replies directed to me such as 'Dude epic fail', As apposed to calling my statement ludicrous? regarding you're incorrect statement about Hitler, where it's all becoming a little unfortunate to read or bother replying to a person who feels compelled to write as such. Or someone who dosnt answer criticism of their viewpoints? Also, please learn how to use apostrophes, capital letters and punctuation in the right places as well as some of your spelling.

I honestly feel you're edging towards getting unnecessarily personal

Pot Kettle Black

Particular topics of discussions such as these, never reach a satisfactory conclusion, even I admit that. I do not want to go banging on about it, like a shit house door in a storm, arguing the toss and taking up the thread with all this and I suspect it's tedious for others having to trawl through as well. Accept the fact I like Dawkins, which was a simple statement I made at the very beginning and you'll just have to live with it, which I certainly don't have to justify or explain why to someone who doesn't and to an individual I have never met, over the internet. No but your you used your freedom to express it, i'm using my freedom to question it, all freedoms come with responsibility If you think my admiration of Dawkins is wrong or bad or how I consider religion a complete waste of time, then you should hear my views on other delicate subjects {heinous lol}, but that won't happen here my friend, it's simply the wrong place for it and I would wager, most members here would agree and I respect that. Theres a new thread button that could be used?

So whatever it is you want answering here, I suggest you find other sources that seek the dislike and criticism of Dawkins and do give it a rest with snide remarks. Apologies I simply don't have time for this. I admire Dawkins, you don't, so what! Nothing, i was expressing my view, asking questions, you havent answered. So what?

Now back to work. Enjoy

geoffk wrote:"Shantaram" by Gregory David Roberts. Plenty of charras smoking in this book.

DeathRowRecords wrote:'Homicide - A Year on the Killing Streets'. By David Simon - if you like HBO's 'The Wire' you should check it out - he wrote both.

happydaze777 wrote:

geoffk wrote:"Shantaram" by Gregory David Roberts. Plenty of charras smoking in this book.

also knee deep in this book (and the reason I am going to India this Christmas, rather than Amsterdam!)

Also re-reading one of my favourite books The Alchemist, changed my life the first time I read it and continues to do so...

Great idea for a thread, thank you!